The good DS (delta sigma) dacs that aren't hard or harsh, are a bit of a yawn, and lack bringing out the life (boogie factor) of the music, but in a . By Talking of cool lets talk about this remote. DAVE is the most advanced DAC Chord Electronics has ever made. in this forum and they are all very good dacs. Once complete there are measurements and functional tests before the final products are inspected, cleaned, and packed up ready to be shipped, but not before a white glove inspection by either Jonathan or Daniel. Im outputting directly to the LAB12 (and later a Krell KST100) power amp and so a digital volume algorithm is used where the digital volume control is left at a relatively high output so as not to encounter loss at lower volume levels. It's my understanding that the Wavedream only MSB Technology Discrete Modular DAC Page 2. And what streamer are you using to feed the DAC? This one has similar sound signature to MSB Premier But it is half notch below MSB Premier on dynamics, details, soundstage. When I have done the comparison with other DACs I have had at the same time - Ayre QX5-Twenty, EAR Dac 4, exasound e32 - often the immediate impression is that DAVE/Blu 2 is not quite as good - a bit dryer sounding, not quite as smooth, not as airy or three dimensional And yet, over the longer term, it is deeply satisfying at a musical level in a way that the other DACs are not. I say take what everyone post when a grain of salt, because an individual's preference may be different than yours. Well this is going to set the cat amongst the pigeons for sure. Each clock is made up of two independent clocks but only one is used at any given time so as not to add unwanted noise to the circuit. Sent from my SM-G928V using Computer Audiophile mobile app. msb discrete dac vs chord dave - 1click3d.com Guess what I am trying to say is: preamps are important. I like all this attention to detail and the MSB website suggests a company that is massively proud of its American heritage and of the products they make. In my assessment the Makua offered a more open and spacious sound. For example, the chassis for the products are made from North American-sourced metals, and then that is machined using Haas CNC machines that are built in California. Astrostar here, said it completely blew away any dac he had before, and mind you, he has the entry level AC model. @smodtactical I would not take price as any arbitrator of quality, especially nowadays. Chord DAVE DAC Preamp Amplifier - Moon Audio The Discrete is a genuine high fidelity DAC and a fabulously built one to boot, add in the modular input flexibility and you have a pretty stunning product with excellent future proofing. The Chord Qutest DAC has the same DAC architecture and filters as the Chord Hugo 2. To cut a long story short: A burnt in MSB Analog DAC with Power Base demoed side to side to a burnt in DAVE was no challenge for the MSB. Like the rest of the DACs in the MSB range, the Select DAC is modular in its architecture with each of the modules being produced in house, as outlined above. The only thing that I'd really like to see added here is an Aries Cerat. and as I said earlier there is no "best" when it comes to dacs or Snookered into the Chord Electronics Hugo TT2? - A Review Best DACs comparison test result [[My Subjective Opinion]] Euphony Summus, EtherRegen, MSB Discrete. I did try with just the one power supply and the Discrete remained a very strong performer with the differences being a very slight loss in the sense of separation and definition when listening intently. It is a manual step which I forgot. Additionally, MSBs robust in-house design enables the finest quality playback of PCM and native DSD, while our low impedance circuitry drives your amplification directly without adding coloration or buffering noise. There's 340 pages packed with HiFi Reviews, Industry Interviews and much more. The sonic signature is detailed and yet easy to listen to, with the Discrete bringing a sense of the recordings scale (big or small) to the listening experience. The world's largest high-end audio community. But digital, potentially, can change things. I cant help with comparisons of two of these DACs, but I did hear the Tambaqui up against the dCS Bartok and it was a pretty close call, but ultimately the dCS sounded more analogue and more immersive, I have heard the Dave and EMM Labs DAC2x up against aMakua that I subsequently purchased. At this kind of price, it puts Chord DAVE as being direct competition and I said that DAVE was the best DAC Id heard back in 2018. Who knows ?! Of those, I've only heard the DAVE. It may not display this or other websites correctly. It would only sound like sales so we Still would like to listen to the Soulution 760 DAC, Mola Mola DAC, Trinity DAC, MSB Select DAC, and maybe the Light Harmonic Da Vinci DAC, Gryphon Kalliope DAC, TotalDAC of some kind, Phasure NOS1A DAC, Esoteric Grandioso DAC, TAD DA1000 DAC, Audionet DAC, Chord Dave DAC . HiFiMan Ananda, SR Orange fuses, Taiko Audio Daiza platforms, Startech FMC optical network link, Oyaide EE f/s2.0 V2 mains spurs, Akiko Audio tuning sticks, GIK Acoustic TriTraps/panels. The other stand out dacs that we like are the Conversely, you could spend a lot more and not gain a great deal in real terms. For the most part, I used this input and for a quick comparison one of the optical inputs. Great Dac but for me a NOS DAC (Metrum Adagio) won the contest over all the others Dacs I have tried so far. Also; recently MSB introduced a new interface that optimizes USB and adds fibre to reduce noise, the MSB Pro USB. Personally we have A/B 76 different digital front ends.. Was it a speaker setup or headphone setup? Fair enough if you know some of the posters here and their listening preferences. Unless they have the exact same components as the end user, it's impossible to tell that customer how component X will sound in their system. Anyway, the little bit of extra detail on the strings, the attack, and decay are all there to be heard and its a marvelous thing to listen to. You absolutely can say that you prefer other DAC's to the Berkeley Alpha Reference. With two prime DACs, we yield an unprecedented level of detail, reproducing the musicality, soundstage, and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. Toggle signature. as far as direct comparison with other dacs the closest Ive done is listening to the Select II at shows and then listening to other top dacs in other systems at shows. After that you are GOLDEN. Mola Mola Pre/dac review compared to DAVE dac - Page 2 - DAC - Digital The Discrete Power Supply feeds the DAC with dual low-noise power streams that are linear and independent. Thats why were thrilled to offer up to 100% trade-in value for existing MSB products when upgrading to a higher performing series. Digital inputs : RCA coax, AES/EBU XLR, 2x Toslink optical, 2x module slots, word . There are separate optimal PCM and DSD modes for playbacks and bit perfect playback is how DAVE performs optimally as the FPGA up samples and noise shapes everything to 104MHz 5-bit. It's better than the MSB Analog I listened to. Of course your opinion on sound quality is your own, and valid, but to suggest that the reason for the difference is because the Chord is an "FPGA DAC" is technically incorrect. Whats Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. You could spend less and get close to the sound of this DAC, for sure. Best DAC you ever heard? | Steve Hoffman Music Forums This would help to take your digital playback upa few levels. and build quality is also excellent. Stainless steel buttons arrayed around an elegant volume wheel to optimize performance and response. This gives us lots of headroom for future sample rates and audio formats.. The Base module has two outputs (high and low) depending on whether you are outputting to a preamplifier or directly to a power amplifier. That statement makes sense in an analog paradigm. In that time, weve pushed the industry forward with each product weve built, redefining whats possible. As you pursue higher levels of playback, an MSB upgrade path is always available to help drive your own desire for innovation. Pass Labs INT-60. Over the air updates will ensure that your renderer always has the latest capabilities and ultimate convenience. The next module is the display which is a cool and easy-to-read LED that is slaved to the audio clock. Is it too hot to touch? I have listened to MSB Analog DAC and Diamond DAC IV but not in the same setup as DAVE. There are some tonal differences too, but what you prefer will depend on your other equipment and the music you like. MSBs top-level DAC is 121K and there are other brands out there offering very expensive options, but the truth is that the vast majority of people will never feel the need to spend that kind of money (even if they could) to eek out that last-minute bit of detail. I would say go for one of the other MSB ModelsThe Reference is half of the Select dac and the premier and discrete dacs are stunning performers for their price level Just in case it's not obvious, toetapaudio is a Mola Mola Dealer. Looking forward to the your additions to the list. All rights reserved. One name that was thrown around by a few people I know is the Rockna Wavedream. But DAVE also seems to me to highlight the original recording so if the recording is flat, the playback sounds flat (still with great accurate timbre) but if the recording really showcase the soundstage and the 3-dimensionality of the instruments and vocals, DAVE really portrays that well. I also looked at the MSB Discrete DAC but everything thing was an extra cost option (USB, AES/EBU, power supply, etc.,) and expensive. The end result is a digital experience defying expectations. Supported Formats (Depending on Input) 44.1 kHz to 3.072kHz PCM up to 32 bits 1xDSD, 2xDSD, 4xDSD, 8xDSD Accepts DSD via DoP on all inputs, Digital Inputs 1x RCA Coaxial 1x XLR 1x Word-Sync Out 2x Toslink 2x Isolated slots for optional modules, XLR Outputs Voltage: 3.57 Vrms Maximum Impedance 300 High Gain setting Impedance 150 Low Gain setting. Ok, I looked a prat but it proves that the separate PSUs are actually doing something rather than being there for show, though they do look rather cool in themselves. The Discrete DAC Features - MSB Technology You must log in or register to reply here. The Prime DAC Module. You already have a very top tier DAC. @shkong78 how good is the dave + mscaler vs msb? I wanted to know for anyone who has heard it have you also heard a DAC that approached it in sonic performance? The Discrete DAC uses two of these modules per unit. Compared to some other similarly priced DACs ($10 - $15k MSRP) I prefer the Discrete with 2 Discrete PS. Would I pay extra for the second supply? conversation. And I make Best DAC Quality Ranking list. Complete electrical isolation Like the Lab12. There is a real sense of spectacle and scale when the MSB is in the system. 5 other people who only have 2 things in common with our system. If you go reference you will never look back. It was a speaker setup (as in my signature.) Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Eris II rack on Herbie's titanium footers | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room. There is scale on bigger productions and intimacy on smaller-scale recordings and pieces, It wont make a pigs ear into a sows purse, but its majestic on really good recordings, Its very detailed but not harshly so actually, its a very easy component to fit in a system and live with, Its not cheap and you will want both PSUs once you compare with just one, No analogue inputs to make it the heart of a full system, You know that MSB have stuff that is out of reach financially and potentially better, Price: 11,000 plus 1,650 for a second power supply. The in-house discrete design is then constructed into its own shielded CNC pocket for optimal isolation. This hobby is "highly subjective", influenced by personal feelings, tastes, or opinions; therefore you can A/B a million different components and come to a completely different conclusion on how it sounds compared to another listener. The headamp is powerful but not involving. Up to 32 bit 768kHz Of the ones you mentioned I'd be most tempted by the Emm Labs DAC 2x though if you can get a used higher-end Esoteric, you should jump on it. personal preference." https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/how-to-support-audio-science-review.8150/, Check the true bit-depth of your files and audio engine, Guide to Subwoofer Calibration and Bass Preferences, Know your limits (Sound Exposure Safety Chart), Topping DX7 Pro+ vs Chord DAVE measurements (Cosmos ADC) - DAVE is better in some areas (surprise! It doesnt get too hot to touch. An FPGA does not have analog output, in the Chord DACs, the FPGA handles digital processing only, not conversion from digital to analog. - Roon Endpoint. There are so. http://www.computeraudiophile.com/members/mikejazz/, funded this campain: http://igg.me/at/geekpulseaudio/x/5216671. Copyright Hifi Pig and Hifi Pig Magazine, Big Pig Media LLP. This is the main advantage of DAVE (i.e. This kind of sound really appeals to me and was really excellent to experience on lots of tunes, but was especially evident on tracks from Rumours with every part of the mix being identifiable as unique. They are excellent pairing. Have you thought about hooking up a Blu2 to Dave? To my ears it makes music sound unnatural. CD - SACD DAC player Music Server MSB Technology, CH precision,Chord You'll be shocked by how much you lose by going through a separate preamp. It seems to me that manufacturers are jacking up the price for the perception of quality. I can see that in an A/B comparison, many other DACs sound more impressive than DAVE/Blu2. The Chord DAVE was also on my list, but I decided to pass (my Chord retailer was very 'pushy' and not helpful). dCS Bartok>Chord DAVE>MSB discrete discreteR2R R2R DAVE BartokdCSBartok Some silly sausage plugged a white power cable into a black device. Sound Media Group Pty Ltd The DAVE DAC does not perform anywhere near where it should. I could not so, after 2 years of trying, I bought it. Aurender W20-> Lampizator Pacific SE -> Ayon Crossfire III or Circle Labs A100 -> Avantgarde Acoustic Trio LE 26 with 4x REL Carbon Special ,SACD Player: Audio Aero La Fontaine. I haven't yet come across one DAC that is best and will completely dominate other great DACs across all audio evaluation parameters. When a dealer post something you have to take it with a enormous grain of salt. I suppose that the vast majority of people who listen for pleasure at home are looking for a balance between the two, and whilst I still maintain we are most likely to hear the biggest effect in a system by changing transducers, every element in the chain of sound will affect the final sound and, in a digital system, I think the DAC you choose can have a huge effect on the final sound. Since this forum is mainly USA based and we are in the UK, I have very little to gain business wise here. 1 - MSB Discrete 2 - dCS Bartok 3 - Mola Mola Tambaqui 4 - Chord DAVE (add the M Scaler later) 5 - Keep my Ayre QX-5 Twenty, do nothing Thanks! If so I'd recommend the Aqua Formula xHD and the TotalDAC d1-Seven. The main reason we took on Rockna was because their I would have loved if you heard them in the same system for a direct comparison. With two prime DACs, the MSB Discrete yields an unprecedented level of detail that reproduces the musicality, soundstage and texture of an original performance, bringing the artist to you. My friend who owns the Diamond DAC IV prefers the MSB. But in the specific case of the BADA and PM2, if you wish for me to be more precise, then taking into account that I only had the BADA ref for a very short time, the bottom line was that I didn't feel at the time that the difference between the PM2 in my system was significant enough to make it worth the energy to change components or the potential financial loss involved in a trade. JavaScript is disabled. You'd expect Audiosanctuary to understand what a gutless amp sounds like, and at least put a headphone amp in front of that DAVE, if they wanted to sell people either the DAVE or the headphones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites. So true jr, the discrete R2R Multibit dacs like the Terminator the Holo, MSB, Total ect ect have a life and a boogie factor to the music that DS dacs lack, and yes they do show up bad recordings. First I want to say that I fully agree that the hobby is What effect does reconstruction filter have? 2. November 11, 2020 in Digital Sources, DACs, and Computer Audio. subjective to a point and that is why we do blind testing and A/B testing with How does the PS Audio DirectStream DAC compare to the Chord DAC? Analogue Volume Control 1dB from 0 to 106 Deactivable by menu, Dimensions ChassisWidth : 432 mmDepth: 305 mmHeight without feet: 51 mm. Wavedream only has a couple hours on it, but from the first note it The more observant of you will have read this and noticed that there is no mains inlet. Thanks for the interesting reply, cmarin. Dealer's should be required to state they're a dealer every time they post or have a disclaimer in their username. Links may be used, provided that full and clear credit is given to Hifi Pig and Big Pig Media with appropriate and specific direction (link) to the original content. ), Chord Hugo 2 Review (Portable DAC & HP Amp), DAC Noise Modulation: Chord DAVE vs Topping DX7 Pro+, Digital To Analog (DAC) Reviews and Discussion, Amplifiers, Phono preamp, and Analog Audio Review. It is my name after all! MQA decoding Its headphone amplifier is good but no match for higher powered units. But MSB Select 2 is regarded by many as the best thats why for something 1/10 of the price to compete in anyones eyes is quite an accomplishment. Dave gets a "thumbs up" overall from me though. How hot does the Chord DAC get? I may need to reset expectations a bit lower: This is an update to some old DAVE vibration control posts. MSB thrives off the innovation required to meet consumer demands. It seems to take in zeros and ones and then somehow make sense of these and just convert them into faithful reproductions of the recording though me not being at the recording of any of the records I listened to, thats my assumption coming into play. Too objective for subjectivists; too subjective for objectivsts. The bottom line for me is that great DACs can make a difference over good DACs. The modular nature of the Discrete and other MSB DACs is very clever and I assume this goes a good way towards giving it such a neutral and detailed sound, where no one part is interfering with what the other is doing. I understand that audio stores and distribution companies have the opportunity to A/B a significant amount of equipment. The SQ is amazingly good. Tailored for both the transport and the DACs daily use, our remote brings you closer to the music you love. There are a lot of people that absolutely love the M-scaler. what Im saying is that comparing dacs also must take into account of all the interface advantages of each particular dac. Bespoke Audio Ultimate Silver TVC passive preamp, Totaldac xlr version D1-Drivers x2, Eisteddfod 340 & 840 amps, Magico S5 speaker, MSB Select DAC, MSB Select Transport, Nakamichi 700 XLE cassette deck, Taiko Audio Extreme Server, Tripoint Troy Signature NG groundbox, PLiXiR Elite 1500 isolation transformers. At some point you have to be content in this hobby. To me, the instrumental timbre seems more accurate with DAVE than any other DACs I've heard. This latter recording gets played to death at shows, but that doesnt detract from it being a very good tune and a very good recording, though I have been known to take the piss a bit when it gets played for the tenth time in a day at audio events. Many of these were already in a shootout on Audiogon with the same requirements - has to sound stellar on 16/44.1 tracks: I agree that the DAVE plus Blu 2 is spectacular, but not in a "hi fi" sense. sounds like a more transparent Chord Dave to my ears. SoundLab A1Px's, ARC REF40, VTL Siegfired II, cj GAT2, cj ART, DCS Vivaldi 2.0 stack, Taiko Audio SGM Extreme, TechDas AF1+ , Graham Phamtom III, Sumiko Palo Santos, vdH Black Beauty, ARC Phono 3, Studer A80, Crystal Dreamline, Transparent Audio Ref XL digital and Ref Gen V power cables, CenterStage footers, Nordost Qkore6' s and QB8's! I haven't heard MSB or theDenafrips DAC. will every hear. I do however like the i2S connection better than any other This DAC is 11,000 and as such, it is a considerable investment to make, but I would suggest that this is not stupid money for the kind of transparency and clarity it brings. Auction bid 7 150 25 . https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-rothschild-70aab85/, Headphones and Personal Audio with Pitch Perfect Service. I wanted to know for anyone who has heard it have you also heard a DAC that approached it in sonic performance? However, there are also products that manage to straddle both sides of the electric fence (whilst being careful not to electrocute their nether regions) and give us a tremendously enjoyable reproduction of a recording whilst remaining true to the source material. You are using an out of date browser. I have a PS Audio DSD ATM and it is also on the warm side which is good, but I'm thinking I need something more neutral due to my speakers being fairly warm and full bodied in their own right to take my system to the next level. But if you don't, what is your reference point? Concluding that there is some kind of problem with using an FPGA vs. what MSB does is not technically supportable. MSB Technology's Discrete DAC was the best DAC I'd heard in my systemuntil the MSB Premier showed up. Sources: Hiby R6, Fiio x3II, Fiio x5II DACs: Dave, Yggdrasil, Hugo, Hugo TT, U12. And differences at that level can be good. Check out the awards + accolades. Stuart Smith finds out. DAVE stands for 'Digital to Analogue Veritas in Extremis', a moniker that best reflects the product's . For such a high entry price I wouldn't take the gamble to go on some recommendation by a stranger whose tastes I don't know. Hope to try different formats on both DACs to see what works best in my system. Too many DACs> Too many amps> Too many headphones. I don't want to waste hifi shops time too much knowing I'll be going second hand either. Audiogon Discussion Forum Less experience with Dave on DSD, plus Rob claims to no longer decimate. I'm not an absolutist, and frankly, I could be happy with any of the DACs I mentioned. This is a very odd one to describe but came to the fore on tracks like Pan Eros from World Of Drums and Percussion. As I said, its an odd one to describe but you do hear it as it brings a sense of rightness to rhythm tracks. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $14,000. The DACs are individually shielded and thermally-bonded and multiple units are used per channel, which MSB tells us increases performance and lowers output impedance. Nothing was amiss. Amplification: Cyrus Mono x300Signatures. The other thing I've learned about the Chord Dave is it can sound very different depending on the interconnect and/or power cord used. Like the rest of the main body of the DAC and the PSUs, the remote is hewn from a block of aluminium. First let me preface my comments by stating that I have not heard a lot of high end DACs in my system. If you send me a dave i will happily be your 4th friend who also owns a dave. Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator, https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/absolute-top-tier-dac-for-standard-res-redbook-cd. An FPGA does not have analog output, in the Chord DACs, VLC | M-Audio FastTrack Pro | Mac Opt | Panasonic SA-HE100 | Logitech Z623, : SET Tube Amp | Low-Noise Linear Regulated Power Supply | USB, Power, Speaker Cables | Speaker Stands | Acoustic Panels, http://igg.me/at/geekpulseaudio/x/5216671. Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Eris II rack on Herbie's titanium footers | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room. Sounds shrill on my workstation and work laptop. MSB Discrete DAC - What's Best Forum I think my DAVE sounds great with everything. The MSB simply offered more of everything and to my ears proved again that a true multi bit converter/ladder DAC is superior to delta/sigma or FPGA DACs. UPnP Protocol Along with an integrated clock, changing this card allows switching between single-ended and balanced outputs. 2 DAC | Audionet Pre G2 preamp | Audionet Max mono blocks | Vivid Audio Giya G2 Series 2 | 4 JL Audio Fathoms | Echole ICs /SCs / Siltech Classic 550L jumpers, Shunyata PCs / Eth. Thank you all for your answers. Were constantly improving digital input modules to stay at the forefront of the high-end audio industry, ensuring youre always equipped with the most current digital file formats and interfaces. Is this what passes for high end? Chord Msb Dac Dave Vs Discrete [FZ8OTP] - amministrato.to.it
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